How should a standard R drive?

[Foxdog]

Hi guys, posted this on the modifiers website but due to most people having only driven modified cars i thought i would post it here as well.

[SIZE=+0]Hi guys, just to start ive tried searching this, but i cant find anything that really answers it.


Ive had my 93 pulsar for about a month now. Its completely standard apart from after market alloys.




I am just after some information about how these cars should generally drive and perform in standard condition? None of my mates have ever owned an R so cant really help.

My car seems to have a very high bite on the clutch, almost like its a paddle clutch.

It seems to drive fine, it seems to start spooling around 2800 with full boost close after 3000rpm. It feels like a good strong pull. mine is measured in mmHG. when i first put the foot down, it goes up to +7 calmes down to about +5 or so if you keep throttle. I set up a standard PSI guage and found that mostly its boosting about 8 - 9 psi which im told is normal, but sometimes it gets quite big spikes, going up to about 14 psi. this doesnt happen often and most of the times i check boost its 9psi.

The thing is... i duno.

My mate had a glanza, which he had modded a fair bit on standard turbo. he front mounted it, upped the boost to what i think was 1.2 bar if i remember right, replaced standard filter with one that came straight off his turbo, removed the air con. He never had it mapped, but he did get some kind of electronic device that altered the air/fuel to match the boost.

I would probably say that the glanza felt 'slightly' faster than the pulsar at the moment. Mainly it seems that the glanza contiinued to boost freely throughout the range, where the pulsar seems to be lacking higher up the revs. This might just be me, as i never drove the glanza myself im speaking from being a passanger.

its just, the glanza is 7 seconds to 60, where as the pulsar is 5.4.

could these modifications have made it perform to a standard pulsars figures?

sorry for the long dragging post, im just curious and would like to know how a standard pulsar performs and if mines is right, im due a full service which im getting next week as the owner before had it serviced when he got it imported 2 years ago... i was shocked and asked why he had not had it done every 6 months and he said its because hes only covered 3k miles within the period he had it.

thanks,
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[PobodY]

Bloody hell, haven't I already had this conversation with you!? :doh:

The owner's club might be more helpful that the modifiers for a standard car (before anyone gets huffy with me, it looked like I was the only one on the modifiers with anything to say on the subject... and it is the modifiers site so by definition it's for modified cars). ;-)

To get people up to speed, he's got a bleed valve wound all the way in at the moment. So I've said that he's making less than factory boost, and not to worry too much until it gets wound-out a bit.

 

[John]

The Glanza speed feeling will only be because you are a passanger, when I drive my car it doesnt feel fast atol because I am in control, however there has been times I have been out as a passanger in my car on a test run and it feels so much faster due to me having no control.

The glanza is also alot lighter and probably would only be a shade slower than a stock R once moving, however from a standstill a R would have a huge advantage due to the 4wd, however once the Glanza has traction the lower tranny loss of fwd will negate some of the power advantage of the a 4wd car.

A few people on here have totally stock or nigh on stock cars so should be able to give you a better indication on driving a stock R, however id get it serviced asap as 2 years is way to long without a service! Your car is also making less than stock boost so that needs to be investigated also.

 

[PobodY]

Ah - as the area rep for Scotland, can you recommend another member to have a look over his car for him (he's in Edinburgh IIRC)?

I don't think the boost dropping off is an issue; Fast Guy was saying that's quite normal for the standard turbo, I think it's to do with reaching a point where the exhaust gasses actually pull the wastegate open against the actuator.

 

[Foxdog]

Bloody hell, haven't I already had this conversation with you!? :doh:

The owner's club might be more helpful that the modifiers for a standard car (before anyone gets huffy with me, it looked like I was the only one on the modifiers with anything to say on the subject... and it is the modifiers site so by definition it's for modified cars). ;-)

To get people up to speed, he's got a bleed valve wound all the way in at the moment. So I've said that he's making less than factory boost, and not to worry too much until it gets wound-out a bit.

I apologise i dont mean to look stupid the reason ive posted on this site as well is because i was advised to due to the previous one being for modified cars.

I was under the impression that if i turned the bleed valve right down that it would just produce the cars standard boost.

the only reason the bleed valve was put in was because i was told its one of the first things you should do as the standard solonoid can be unreliable...

Looks like the bleed valve is worse though judging by the spikes :S

again sorry i just wanted to get a heads up on how a standard R drives from someone thats droven one in standard form

 

[John]

Ah - as the area rep for Scotland, can you recommend another member to have a look over his car for him (he's in Edinburgh IIRC)?

I know Fire & Skill is around the Edinburgh Area, whether he has the time or the knowledge to diagnose any faults I dont know tho as I know he no longer owns a R anymore however does still pop in from time to time.

 

[PobodY]

Don't worry you don't look stupid!
I didn't mean to harass you; I just came from replying to your thread on the other site... and here it is on this one too.

It's not for me to tell you to come on here, it might be misconstrued if a moderator on this site is telling you to sign-up on the other one (where I'm not a mod).

I think you need to wind that bleed valve out a bit, I'm guessing you bought it recently so you're not inclined to buy a different one (that doesn't spike)... if it's any consolation I had an HKS EVC that just died; I'd set it at 0.9 bar and at 1.1 the overboost alarm would go off. Not helpful, so I tried to fix it myself, and that just made it worse... so now I'm back to a bleed valve too (but mine seems to be holding fine).
You could set it at 10psi on a standard car without any problems. - I don't know about the standard solenoid; I've never had one on my Pulsar, but I had one on my Skyline and it seemed to be reliable enough... but I didn't really push the tuning on that.

There's at least one other member who has a very standard R and is happy with it that way. I think he wants to make any mods himself so that he knows what they do; have a look for his thread (if I find it I'll put a clicky in).

 

[whytie]

I have a close to standard R running standard boost slight mods air filter, dump valve decated and never had a problem with it. I also have a near 100% stock R. This one doesnt feel all that quick decat makes a massive difference. This one also has the same issue with clutch high bitting point feels like a paddel clutch. Im then guessing clutch is on its way out. For a standard R dont expect it to be super quick.

 

[Foxdog]

Don't worry you don't look stupid!
I didn't mean to harass you; I just came from replying to your thread on the other site... and here it is on this one too.

It's not for me to tell you to come on here, it might be misconstrued if a moderator on this site is telling you to sign-up on the other one (where I'm not a mod).

I think you need to wind that bleed valve out a bit, I'm guessing you bought it recently so you're not inclined to buy a different one (that doesn't spike)... if it's any consolation I had an HKS EVC that just died; I'd set it at 0.9 bar and at 1.1 the overboost alarm would go off. Not helpful, so I tried to fix it myself, and that just made it worse... so now I'm back to a bleed valve too (but mine seems to be holding fine).
You could set it at 10psi on a standard car without any problems. - I don't know about the standard solenoid; I've never had one on my Pulsar, but I had one on my Skyline and it seemed to be reliable enough... but I didn't really push the tuning on that.

There's at least one other member who has a very standard R and is happy with it that way. I think he wants to make any mods himself so that he knows what they do; have a look for his thread (if I find it I'll put a clicky in).

Thanks guys for the advice.

I want to eventually modify the car to higher levels, maybe around the 300bhp mark. But before i consider any modifications i would like to know that the car is running how it should, hence all my questions

Its really the boost that is annoying me. i just want to run it at the standard boost the car would run from new out the garage. Ive been told a lot of different views on what the car SHOULD be boosting standard.

The problem is the boost guage that comes standard mmHG, and like i said, when i apply throttle to turbo spooling point, it will boost up to +7 on this guage, then start to fall higher up the rev range to +5.5ish.

i think im right with converting 7mmHG to 14psi? thats not right surely?

im happy to get rid of the manual boost controller as its just the cheap Ebay one

The only reason i bought it was because i was told it would boost more accurately than the standard cars measures.

i was really wanting to know what boost is shown on someone elses standard pulsar that measures in mmHG rather than PSI (i gather all imports will be in mmHG?)

If the car is meant to boost standard at 0.65 bar, then surely it should only show as +5 on my mmHG guage and not +7 as it does?

 

[Foxdog]

dont know if this helps, but this is the controller used

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Boost-Control...arts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item1c0f40208a

 

[PobodY]

Yeah, it's a bit confusing that Nissan chose to use Torr (mmHg) rather than pascals (or bar) for that gauge; 100 Torr (the unit the gauge is in) ~0.133bar (or 1.9psi). So the gauge actually goes from -700 to 700 torr (-13.5 psi to +13.5psi... or 0.9 bar) - Sunnys come with a PSI gauge there instead.

So it sounds like you're hitting about 0.9 bar (~13.5psi) before it drops to ~0.7 (or ~10.5psi; where I would have thought it should be). That seems like a big boost spike for a standard setup, and if you're regularly hitting 0.9 bar I can see why you're worried about leaning-out. In all fairness it could be the gauge that's telling you porky pies; they're not known to be wonderfully accurate (and mmHg is really for barometric pressures because the value goes up and down with temperature, just like a thermometer; that's why it's hard to pin-down a conversion for the vales it gives you).
Anyway, 7mmHg is ~14psi at 0 degrees centigrade; at 20 (as an example) 7mmHg is less pressure.

Curiouser and curiouser... I'm not really helping any more so maybe I should stop filling your threads with my waffle.

 

[shroom]

buy a 2 bar boost guage and have a look lol, f*ck the stock one

 

[Fast Guy]

The thing with a standard Gtir is that the power deliver is smooth so you don't get that kick in the back that makes it feel fast. It just pulls from idle until it runs out of puff.

 

[abyss]

with a rolling start on high boost up until about a 112mph a glanza racing a pulsar the pulsar will have it by a car length if totally standard.

 

[campbellju]

Bleed valves are not great at controlling boost, I would avoid. A cheap mod for stock to 1.2bar that is as good as many fancy aftermarket boost controllers is a dawes device. This is a simple mechanical boost controller.

As already said, fit a mechanical boost gauge to understand what is really happening. I expect using the bleed valve to control boost is why you are seeing spikes.

 

[Foxdog]

Ok i checked the boost on a psi plug in guage, and it seems to be boosting up to 14psi :S

thats with the bleed valve turned right down...

so ive been driving the car slow or only slight throttle making sure it doesnt boost above 9.

if i rip this valve out and just connect it to standard setup will this solve the problem?

 

[PobodY]

i used to own a starlet on standard engine not forged they very rarly run over a bar they just got bang allthough you can with the correct fuel modz but they dont recomend it

What has that got to do with this? - It has all the hallmarks of spam.

 

[Matt Evans]

When you say the bleed valve is turned right down, do you mean you've tightened as far as it will go?

If so, you'll be getting full boost mate! You need to slacken it off a little until you reach the desired boost level. Either that or you've got a block/restricted pipe somewhere.

Also, don't expect a bleed valve to hold boost very accurately, they're not very good. It'll probably overboost slightly every time you reach peak boost, but then it should drop back to the set point.

Hope this helps.

 

[dotalot]

If so, you'll be getting full boost mate! You need to slacken it off a little until you reach the desired boost level. Either that or you've got a block/restricted pipe somewhere.

When you tighten a bleed valve, you are opening the valve and dropping the boost. You wind it out to restrict vacum flow and increase boost.

 

[Matt Evans]

Thanks dotalot, I was hoping someone would rectify my error. I was still half asleep earlier and only just realised what I said was completely incorrect! So, the bleed valve is wound all the way in and he's still getting around 13.5 psi? Try removing the bleed valve and reconnecting the pipe to see what boost value you get. If its still 13.5 psi I'm thinking a blockage somewhere, if its all ok, then maybe a duff bleed valve. Have you checked the valve over to make sure there's nothing stuck inside it?